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Post by roland on Apr 8, 2009 17:22:35 GMT
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Post by annie on Apr 8, 2009 17:42:31 GMT
Hi roland
Is Medikinet the trade name for Dexamfetamine Sulphate?
annie
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Post by roland on Apr 8, 2009 18:27:52 GMT
Hi Annie,
Medikinet is another methylphenidate like Equasym, Ritalin, and Concerta. About the only differences I could see were in the pill sizes and packaging, as well as differences in price.
Medikinet is produced by Flynn Pharma, Equasym by Celltech Medeva, Ritalin by Novartis Pharmaceuticals, and Concerta by Janssen Cilag.
Equasym® XL and Medikinet® XL are formulated to be similar to twice daily dosing with the immediate-release formulation. The recommended dose is 10mg once daily initially, increased if necessary to a maximum of 60mg once daily.
Concerta® XL (Janssen-Cilag) is formulated to replace three times daily dosing with the immediate-release formulation and is used where treatment effects are required to persist into the evening.
Strattera is atomoxetine and is produced by Eli Lilly, and Dexedrine is dexamfetamine sulphate and is produced by UCB Pharma.
Here are the prices according to an October 2008 shared care agreement form from the Leicestershire Medicines Strategy Group (interestingly they didn't list Medikinet):
Annual cost of medications at licensed doses
Ritalin 5–60 mg in one to two divided doses, £34–£407 Equasym 5–60 mg in one to two divided doses, £34–£364 Concerta XL 18–54 mg once daily, £329–£776 Equasym XL 10–60 mg once daily, £304–£730 Dexamfetamine (Dexedrine) 2.5–40 mg daily, £20–£313 Atomoxetine (Strattera) (10/18/25/40/60mg) one tablet daily, £712
And here are the prices according to a January 2008 shared care protocol from NHS Lothian:
The cost per patient year based on a dose of 30mg daily has been calculated to be £177-203, depending on brand dispensed. This increases to £492 using 36mg daily methylphenidate m/r (Concerta XL®), £426 using 30mg daily methylphenidate m/r (Equasym XL®) and £429 using 30mg daily methylphenidate m/r (Medikinet XL®). (Source: BNF September 2007)
BTW: the Lothian Shared Care Protocol also says the following about cost:
Because of its substantially greater costs, methylphenidate (Concerta XL®/Equasym XL® / Medikinet XL®) should be restricted to second line therapy and used only in exceptional circumstances where the supervising clinician has clear evidence of compliance problems with midday dosing (for example, at school).
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Post by annie on Apr 9, 2009 7:30:48 GMT
Hi roland
Thanks for that. I'm still a bit confused! In the information you found about prescribing for adhd vs statins, it only listed 3 drugs, presumably they are the most common drugs prescribed in the Uk.
They were Atomoxetine, Methylphenidate and Dexamfetamine. Interestingly Dex appears to be rarely prescribed, in comparison with the other two, amongst the six PrimaryCare Trusts in our region - wonder why that is? Anyway is Medikinet the trade name for Dex?
annie
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Post by roland on Apr 9, 2009 8:13:47 GMT
Hi Annie,
Dexedrine is a brand name for dexamfetamine sulphate.
Medikinet is a brand name for methylphenidate hydrochloride.
The information about prescribing for adhd vs statins is a bit confusing because the medications are not listed by their brand name.
Atomoxetine is Strattera.
Methylphenidate could be any of the following four brand names: Ritalin, Concerta, Equasym, and Medikinet (which is one reason why the prescribing costs for methylphenidate look so much higher).
Dexamphetamine is Dexedrine.
Dexedrine is prescribed less often because as a drug it can be much harder on the body (e.g. too much weight loss) than other adhd medications, and as another side effect patients' experience with negative emotional symptoms (insomnia, irritability, anxiety, and sadness) may be more severe when taking Dex.
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Post by pinkbeauty on Apr 9, 2009 10:24:26 GMT
"patients' experience with negative emotional symptoms (insomnia, irritability, anxiety, and sadness) may be more severe when taking Dex"
I can certainly vouch for the weight loss, but didn't know the above. I thought it had got worse but wasn't sure if I was just more aware of myself. Obviously why I cry so much!! And get angry!
PB
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Post by Deleted on Apr 9, 2009 10:46:19 GMT
I'm of the opinion that Dex is perceived to be more 'hardcore', since it's a full amphetamine, than MPH and thus carries the addition baggage of stereotyping as more abuseable (probably true since MPH has an extended binding time in the synaptic cleft and thus has a great reputation for low abuse).
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jeff
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Post by jeff on Aug 8, 2009 16:45:51 GMT
I'm of the opinion that Dex is perceived to be more 'hardcore', since it's a full amphetamine, than MPH and thus carries the addition baggage of stereotyping as more abuseable (probably true since MPH has an extended binding time in the synaptic cleft and thus has a great reputation for low abuse). Does this just mean that it takes a while for the drug to have its full effect? This is a really informative thread! A few questions though... Am I right in saying that there are three main "types" (is that the right word? "Strands"?) of ADHD medication: -methylphenidate -atomoxetine -dextroamphetamine ? Is there a difference between methylphenidate and methylphenidate hydrochloride? What's statins? Thanks. Jeff.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 8, 2009 19:34:33 GMT
MPH is absorbed at the same rate as full amphetamines AFAIK - so injesting means you start to feel the effect in 20 minutes. It sits in the synaptic cleft for a good period denying the sites to other drugs - thus MPH can be used to wean from more 'hardcore' drugs eg cocaine since the cocaine has nowhere to bind if the MPH has already taken the receptor sites.
MPH (methylphenidate) is shorthand for methyphenidate hydrochloride.
You're nearly there with the ADHD meds.
Dex, MPH, Adderal etc are all variations on the amphetamines.
Atomoxetine is the most common exception since it's a NSRI (rather than a DSRI)
Statins are a popular type of drug for reducing cholesterol.
Maybe you were thinking 'beta blockers' which can be useful to treat the hypertension that is common in ADHDers?
There are a whole raft of drugs that could be used to treat the symptoms of ADHD but it must be better to tackle the problem at source and and the moment the best we have is stimulants.
So that ranges from amphetamine style drugs to caffeine and low doses of alcohol (since it's dopaminergic - but alcohol brings more problems with more than very low dosages).
HTH
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jeff
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Post by jeff on Aug 8, 2009 20:33:14 GMT
Brilliant, thanks for the reply I only mentioned statins because pinkbeauty mentioned them and I had no idea what they were. One last thing though... I take it DSRI stands for something along the lines of Dopamine Reuptake Inhibitor? (Google's not helping). Jeff.
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Post by pinkbeauty on Aug 8, 2009 23:30:11 GMT
MPH is absorbed at the same rate as full amphetamines AFAIK - so injesting means you start to feel the effect in 20 minutes. It sits in the synaptic cleft for a good period denying the sites to other drugs - thus MPH can be used to wean from more 'hardcore' drugs eg cocaine since the cocaine has nowhere to bind if the MPH has already taken the receptor sites. MPH (methylphenidate) is shorthand for methyphenidate hydrochloride. You're nearly there with the ADHD meds. Dex, MPH, Adderal etc are all variations on the amphetamines. Atomoxetine is the most common exception since it's a NSRI (rather than a DSRI) Statins are a popular type of drug for reducing cholesterol. Maybe you were thinking 'beta blockers' which can be useful to treat the hypertension that is common in ADHDers? There are a whole raft of drugs that could be used to treat the symptoms of ADHD but it must be better to tackle the problem at source and and the moment the best we have is stimulants. So that ranges from amphetamine style drugs to caffeine and low doses of alcohol (since it's dopaminergic - but alcohol brings more problems with more than very low dosages). HTH Methylphenidate is not amphetamine! They are both stimulants used to treat ADHD but 2 different stimulants that do work differently. The first line drugs for ADHD tend to be stimulants (either methylphenidate or amphetamine based). These work instantly and can be instant or slow release depending on which drug you're on. Very often for a person if 1 doesn't work the other might work better. Then you have the non-stimulant drugs which take longer to get into your system but can also be very effective. PB
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Post by Deleted on Aug 9, 2009 13:16:06 GMT
Keep your hair on PB - MPH isn't an amphetamine - but it is a modified amphetamine (which is why I described it as a variation on the amphetamines).
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Post by Deleted on Nov 16, 2009 12:31:12 GMT
is Medikinet exactly the same as Equasym does anyone know?
I only ask as the pharmacy has substitued a months worth for my usual equasym. I am not sure if i will be able to open the capsules as i have been doing with the equasym. They are in capsule form but my question is whether they will still work if i do this, dont want to open the blister pack in case i have to take them back,
thanks
a
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Post by Deleted on Nov 16, 2009 14:00:19 GMT
hey pipkin, are you trying to open the capsules so you can do your apple sauce thing? ;D -from what i've read, medikinet comes in 2 types, tablet & capsule, the capsule can be opened just like you do with equasym, but the tablet should be swallowed whole. here's a link for ya! emc.medicines.org.uk/medicine/19510/SPC/Medikinet+XL/ good luck - matt
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Post by Deleted on Nov 16, 2009 14:26:16 GMT
Matt
you are my hero.
Yes that's exactly what i wanted to do (apple sauce thing!) and it seems I can. Thanks a lot, I really appreciate your help as i havent taken any today and couldnt get in touch with the pharmacist/ dr!
thanks again
A
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Post by Deleted on Nov 18, 2009 0:27:12 GMT
no problemo pip! ;D
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Post by Deleted on Jan 15, 2010 16:57:08 GMT
There's loads of info on here about meds but there's one question I would like to ask, having not taken and ADHD meds yet:
How do they make you feel?
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Post by Deleted on Nov 6, 2011 8:30:32 GMT
My 21 year old daughter who had been on up to 120 mgs of Prozac, 20mgs of Diazapam for depression and anxiety since she was 13 ( following a traumatic and serious sexual assault) has recently been flushed of her Prozac over an 8 day period and started on Medikinet as she mentioned to the new Phychi that she had trouble concentrating and keeping awake! I'm not a Dr. but felt strongly that the Prozac and Diazapam along with sleeping tablets and 120mgs of codeine per day was most likely to be the reason for her lack of motivation, tiredness and inability to focus. However what do I know I have read side effects of this Medikinet drug and am terrified , it specifically states that it not to be used without therapy (which she has never had HONEST) and there is no research to say that it is beneficial to people over the age of 18 yrs.She has an eating disorder anyway and is getting smaller by the day and has OD'd several times over the past several years. YES the DR knew all her history along with the heart problems on both sides of the family! It also states that no alcohol to be used while on this medication ,how do you stop a 21 year old from having a drink when she wants one ? Is there anyone out there who can reassure me that this Dr isn't a complete Quack please or am I needlessly panicking?
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Post by Deleted on Nov 6, 2011 9:48:27 GMT
Medikinet is a bog standard ADHD medication and is a brand name of methylphenidate hydrochloride (which is best known under the brand name Ritalin). It can suppress appetite and might exacerbate heart problems if present. Reading the included notes in the package can seriously upset your own equilibrium - the warnings usually say side effects include diarrhoea AND constipation and give a very scary impression of what could happen. Lots of us here take methylphenidate and can do quite well on it though most have some side effects - most problematic being anxiety/irritability (which is ironic since it can also reduce these). It's a serious drug but is relatively benign if you keep having health checks and dont do anything silly (like taking a triple dose and then going out and getting smashed - it probably wont kill you but it's not a great idea). Don't be concerned about the warning about not being beneficial for the over 18s. That particular brand hasn't been tested on adults in Europe but other brands of methylphenidate have and have been approved - it costs to get these things approval tested (a lot) so they dont hurry to do them when especially since identical products have been. The therapy....practically nobody gets it in the UK (it's pretty rare) so that's quite a standard experience. Overall - you're right to be concerned considering your daughter has weight loss issues and the family history of heart disease. At her age I'd be mostly worried about the weight loss (us old people love it since I can have an extra cream cake and know I can lose it again ) and her GP should be keeping a close eye on her blood pressure, and other heart indicators, to make sure it's fine. But as long as it's monitored correctly it should be fine. Those warnings in the packets should be banned for being too sensationalist! Everything they say is possible but it's like saying you're going to die every time you get in a car - possible but extremely unlikely.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 7, 2011 6:02:19 GMT
planetdave, thank you for that , quess if I pester GP for regular check ups it maybe helpful and I really want to know the effects of alcohol with this drug even to just forwarn her. She does seem a little more awake and focused but its early days x
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Post by Deleted on Nov 7, 2011 10:36:30 GMT
Combining alcohol with methylphenidate (I use the abbreviation MPH) appears to exacerbate the effect of both.
I've been on MPH for 5+ years and had a problem once when I combined the two - I went out on the lash and had an emotional crisis. Now that I know I can react badly I don't take my meds if I'm going out for a few.
That's my experience - everyone has a different tolerance level for booze, and also for MPH, so the caution is erring on the side of caution - but you really don't want things to go wrong so it's understandable.
Advise daughter not to take meds if going out for a drink and then all you've got to worry about is the booze.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 15, 2011 18:17:10 GMT
My parents told me that I'd die if I mixed Ritalin with any alcohol because of the reaction of the two and I wouldn't make it to a hospital in time. I still don't drink. :-D
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mrsh
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Post by mrsh on Apr 3, 2013 18:58:16 GMT
Hello all, I was wondering if Medikinet has made anyone else more angry/frustrated and brought on more changeable and intense mood swings. I have been on it nearly 2 weeks and it does sod all except make me feel cross and depressed. The concerta was better but side effects and afternoon comedown were way too intense . Hmpf. Cheers
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Post by claudhopper on Apr 3, 2013 19:20:45 GMT
what's your dose?
I'm on 3 x 20mg and going up to 100 and no side effects apart from some loss of appetite.
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mrsh
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Post by mrsh on Apr 3, 2013 19:28:58 GMT
2 x 10mg of medikinet, as concerta 36mg was too much and for some stupid reason he decided to change it instead of let me carry on with 18mg for a bit longer :/
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Post by random on Apr 4, 2013 9:54:18 GMT
What units is Medikinet available in. I am currently on 4x10 but find remembering to take it 4 times a strain. I am loathe to go to taking 20 at a go. I suggested to the general psych that is prescribing it that I would like to try 3x15 but he didn't know whether that is available.
I coud achieve this by spliting the 10s that I already have but am loathe to do this when I am not at home.
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Post by claudhopper on Apr 6, 2013 10:55:53 GMT
I've had 5s 10s and 20s I think Medikinet is just methylphenidate pure and simple, perhaps with a bit of lactose thrown in to make it stick together in a pill. Are you lactose intolerant? One of the funny things about the law concerning prescribing restricted drugs, I've found, is that the doc must write exactly what the dose is. eg: 1 x 5 mg + 1 x 10mg 3 times daily etc. i found this out a few weeks ago when my gp just prescribed what i should be given and the pharmacist (from Boots) sent me back to get it rewritten so i would ask your gp to prescribe you 5s and try seeing what works. i get hardly any side effects so I guess i'm lucky. I'm now on 3 x 25mg a day (that's one 5mg and one 25mg) it seems to be working great and my 'noise' and irritability have reduced considerably. i think my memory has improved although i socialise so rarely it's difficult to tell. If you keep forgetting to take your meds you could set your phone alarm (if you've got one) for the time of each med. I set mine for 9am, 1:30 and 6pm. My psych even suggested that I take 4 x 25mg so I'll have to change my phone alarm settings.
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Post by dizzydee on May 12, 2013 19:53:48 GMT
I was wondering if Medikinet has made anyone else more angry/frustrated and brought on more changeable and intense mood swings. Hello I am only on 5mg 3 times a day as this is my first week, but I was also wondering if any one else felt like this. I am very snappy and quite intolerant to others at the minute. I am also finding it harder to think than normal even putting sentences together is difficult I just can't finish them and give up!! Plus I am still sleeping an awful lot. My question is am I on the right medication, and will this get worse when I got up in dose??
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cc
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Post by cc on Nov 2, 2013 16:45:51 GMT
Hey everyone, I have been taking mph for nearly three weeks now. What i'm finding is that it is very variable day to day and even dose to dose.Perfect example is this morning I took my prescribed 15mg and felt great. Calm, clear etc. Took my second dose and felt groggy and headache and tinnitus. Had to have a bit of a sleep. Can anyone else relate to this. Would love some feedback.
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Post by JJ on Nov 2, 2013 21:29:31 GMT
It can vary according to quite a few things - food, what you're doing (how physical it is), whether you've had alcohol the night before, how much sleep you've had etc... It's a case of trial and error unfortunately and you'll eventually work out the subtle differences - I kept a log on my phone first of all, so I could work out what worked best. I think it's not unusual for people to have more in the first dose and then less in the subsequent ones. From what you've said, and going on my own experience alone, I'd suggest your second dose is either too high or that you took it too soon (for your brain). I'd take your second dose 3/4 hour later than you would normally do - even if it feels like you should take it sooner. Or, if you keep to your existing timings, take 15mg first, then 10 or 12.5mg for the second dose. It's such a fine balance (for me anyway) Be interested to hear how you get on
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