|
Post by carly31 on Jul 11, 2014 21:36:04 GMT
I was just reading through some stuff about how to deal with a colleague who is a bit of of bully.
Only, it's come to my attention that I'm a bully to. It started in secondary school as a way of protecting myself. I was pretty horrible to people, always fighting with boys and targeting people I didn't like. I was trying to be the horrible vile person that I thought I was. I'd hate people who could do things quicker than me. I was so vile that my mum gave up on me by the end.
In my adult life I try very hard to be nice and understanding of others. Which 100% true I really do care.But I'm hit and miss. I'm volatile, frustrated easily and treat people like shit sometimes. I always feel so bad after iv done something. Or said something dismissive to someone.
I wonder if this is because I Learnt to do this instead of developing the normal way and have carried this bulling streak with me into adulthood. How do I do stop? Has anyone had anger management?
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 12, 2014 8:45:07 GMT
I was badly bullied from the moment I entered primary school. That fed my ADHD and helped nurture the symptoms. So I had a rotten home life and then even school was no safe haven. When you're just a kid and you want to die - as I often did, and both home and school are traumatic and chaotic background videos playing out cruelly, then CPTSD comes into play with all its ugly manifestations (@planetdave discusses this also)
But it's good you've admitted your own bullying tendencies and are now trying to address them.
I don't think anyone can deny they've done some bullying in their lives, but I suppose how much we do depends on whether we get labelled with the noun.
I've always thought that "bullies" have their reasons and that it can't be just because they are "bad people" given that I think we are all just a mixture of good and bad.
Thanks for having the courage.
|
|
|
Post by carly31 on Jul 12, 2014 10:19:58 GMT
I'm really sorry to hear you had such a harsh time in your childhood. I'm sorry that I'd have been a part of that in someone else's life to.
With regards to bullies -I had poor attachments to dismissive emotionally cold women and my secure attachment to my father was broken because he'd never turn up when he was meant to. I remember sitting in the widow waiting, and waiting... While he sat in the pub getting drunker and drunker... (my parents separated when I was two).
In school teachers were always disappointed with my performance- the usual adhd stuff - to me I was just worthless and was being punished for being myself. I was nice in primary school albeit a bit defiant with authority but I had lot of friends. I was sexually assaulted when I was 11yrs - I recently won a court case for that, he got 6yrs. My ptsd was triggered during this and has been with me for about 5yrs now - it was then I went off the rails and just turned into a hateful drug/alcohol abusing self harming child. I didn't feel like the right gender and I was struggling with my sexuality. I was rejected by my male peers during puberty because I wasn't the same as them anymore, I was a woman!
I recently noticed that I tend to seek the approval of dismissive people and realised that I've been looking up to bullies! That's when I realised that I must be the same as them. All of this anxiety and inner turmoil I feel is a result of all the shit I've caused people in my life. I believed I was a bad person, deep in my core. On the surface I try to belive I'm kind, I do everything in my power to be compassionate and caring. But I'm so volatile. The truth is never far away. Getting this diagnosis has separated my adhd problems and my unresolved trauma-which is the cause of my hating. It's the Mix of hatred with an impulse control disorder that is most dangerous (not physically, emotionally). I don't feel like a bad 'person' now I've realised this but I'm ashamed of my behaviour and ashamed to think of how I hurt people along the way. Don't really know where to go from here.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 12, 2014 11:14:58 GMT
I see and read a lot of cause and effect passed on from generation to generation from genetics to harsh experiences. As I see it, we can't be too harsh on ourselves as long as we recognise our own failings and forgive others theirs. In other words, whilst I'm angry at the way I was also similarly abused at 14 years of age by a much older male, and the way I was bullied at primary school onwards, I have to find a way to move forward. My own mother created a hell on earth for us as kids and I lived in perpetual fear....but then she's clearly ADHD (albeit in denial) and suffered similar experiences to me as a child herself (her own father was a difficult man to say the least) so I have to try and forgive her and, quite frankly, I want her to find inner peace.
If we go far back enough in time - even to our primordial ancestors, we'll come across relatives and people whose DNA we are made from those who would ordinarily disgust us, whether they be considered heinous criminals or simply connect us genetically to an ADHD diagnosis. The realisation of that frightened me at first, but we are all part of them in the same way as everything in the universe is simply made of different combinations of the same atoms - call it stardust. That's why when you come on here and admit that you "are a bully", for me that's an act of peace and something which should be judged positively and part of your successful move forward.
Imagine if Hitler had gone through this catharsis before becoming leader of the National Socialists in Germany - and I'm not comparing you to him :-), just making a broad-brush analogy that applies to all of us. How different the world might be. Perhaps resultant suffering of genocidal proportions has made us move towards a civilised world much more quickly. Or perhaps its made us much more cynical and had the opposite effect? I really don't know. But what I do know is this: talking about it is healthy.
I wish you well and thank you for talking about your difficult experiences.
|
|
|
Post by twix on Jul 12, 2014 15:11:23 GMT
I learnt something recently called the drama triangle. Victim rescuer persecutor. We swap around the roles. Fascinating model of behaviour.
I can relate to some of what you say and I am not happy with some of my behaviour. Attachment theory is another interesting thing to research.
I suggest finding a good clinical psycologist if you can afford to. Anger management is only part of the jigsaw.
|
|
|
Post by twix on Jul 12, 2014 15:15:40 GMT
|
|
fjord
Member's not posted much yet
Posts: 9
|
Post by fjord on Jul 13, 2014 1:56:49 GMT
Its really brave to come out and say your a bully. I have been bullied in every job I have had, and have come to the conclusion that I am at least 50% blame for it. My boss now is a bully, that's what the others people say, he storms around the office undermining people, jumping on there backs about the smallest detail and general nastiness. There would have been a time I would have said, yeah here it is again a new job and a new office bully, but recently I made a connection about my inability to face conflict and my avoidance of anything that involves conflict. What's worse a bully or a person that under silent protests? I can't describe what really happened but I stood back from these people and saw quite a different person. They call my boss a bully I see a man who is unhappy, that works all hours creating stress, no reflection and all counter attack. I can't say how I changed, and he still speaks to me the same way he did before , but somehow I don't get caught up in the same vicious circle.
I do meditate and have a mentor to help me with this and this has help a huge amount, but precisely what have I done I really don't know.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 13, 2014 8:56:10 GMT
Its really brave to come out and say your a bully. I have been bullied in every job I have had, and have come to the conclusion that I am at least 50% blame for it. My boss now is a bully, that's what the others people say, he storms around the office undermining people, jumping on there backs about the smallest detail and general nastiness. There would have been a time I would have said, yeah here it is again a new job and a new office bully, but recently I made a connection about my inability to face conflict and my avoidance of anything that involves conflict. What's worse a bully or a person that under silent protests? I can't describe what really happened but I stood back from these people and saw quite a different person. They call my boss a bully I see a man who is unhappy, that works all hours creating stress, no reflection and all counter attack. I can't say how I changed, and he still speaks to me the same way he did before , but somehow I don't get caught up in the same vicious circle. I do meditate and have a mentor to help me with this and this has help a huge amount, but precisely what have I done I really don't know. Nice positive response. I don't meditate because I just can't sit still long enough but I have started taking up Tai Chi again which really helps.
|
|
|
Post by carly31 on Jul 13, 2014 10:42:33 GMT
Thank you for sharing your stories with me and thank you for being so understanding. @journeyman there is definitely something about remorse that helps us move forward, unfortunately many people do not actively show us remorse. That is the most difficult thing to come to terms with. It leaves us feeling invalidated and worthless. My abuser showed no remorse whatsoever, they gave him the biggest sentence that was available for the crime he committed. I'd even go as far to say that his defense lawyer messed things up on purpose because she knew he was guilty. The police officer who dealt with the case was clearly disturbed by his arrogance. On a lighter note- qigong is pretty good for ADHD- the structure is less strict than tai chi but very similar practice, is more like dance, you can add or take your own enthusiasm! twix yes the drama triangle is a brilliant way of looking at our lives and an art form staying out of them! People always trying to drag us into them, everywhere we turn there's a little hook to reel us in! I have been better at recognising the cues but my impulsiveness gets me in trouble sometimes/ all the time!. I've been having psychotherapy and EMDR and I'm also trying massage therapy. I'm in the middle of doing a research project about identity to, which has been the most cathartic process so far. fjord it sounds like you have truly stepped into the middle of the drama triangle- that's the position of observer btw- not playing the game. It sounds like you have found peace. I guess with me, I have been more conscious of my bullying/ dismissive side, so my bully just comes out briefly in a flash and then I either apologise or make a clear effort to let the person know it I feel like an idiot and that it's not them. It's hard to get the balance between these. Non-verbal communication works best for flashes of anger- for me and others seem to be forgiving to. I got into Buddhism about 7 months ago so I do try very hard not to cause anything any harm anymore. I don't eat meat and I buy everything with as much education about the suffering caused to humans, animals and land as is possible without starving myself. I guess the most problematic symptom of adhd for me in the impulse control. I guess if I can find peace then the impulses won't be so negative, that's what I'm going to try anyway!
|
|
|
Post by astraka on Jul 13, 2014 20:33:57 GMT
Really interesting discussion. We have a family friend who has a Dx who is flagrantly a bully, but if you can step outside of the drama triangle he is a generous man with a good heart who is dealing with life the only way he knows how to. Life isn't black and white; good for you carly for being so self aware and honest.
|
|
fjord
Member's not posted much yet
Posts: 9
|
Post by fjord on Jul 14, 2014 2:17:32 GMT
"Nice positive response. I don't meditate because I just can't sit still long enough but I have started taking up Tai Chi again which really helps." I did a meditation course awhile back and someone said they got so angry they couldn't do it. They were advised to undertake "walking meditation instead". Might be worth a try. I used to walk around in circles in my bedroom (and to be honest I still do it in the house but only when the wife is out). It helps calm me down. I can get a really good tempo going.
|
|
|
Post by carly31 on Jul 14, 2014 2:56:50 GMT
"Nice positive response. I don't meditate because I just can't sit still long enough but I have started taking up Tai Chi again which really helps." I did a meditation course awhile back and someone said they got so angry they couldn't do it. They were advised to undertake "walking meditation instead". Might be worth a try. I used to walk around in circles in my bedroom (and to be honest I still do it in the house but only when the wife is out). It helps calm me down. I can get a really good tempo going. I get the same thing with mediation, I get really angry. But I suppose that means that those are the dominant feelings you're feeling, they just come to the surface. Walking meditation is brilliant. Just remember to do it at half the pace you normally do
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 14, 2014 10:06:40 GMT
fjord and carly31 re walking meditation - I think I get that with Tai Chi. It's the type of kinesthetic routine which enables me to zone in at the exclusion of other things. I also get it when showering - which is when I get most of my good ideas. All I need is a waterproof dry wipe board (oxymoron alert!) to put these ideas down without forgetting them as soon as the showering process ends
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 14, 2014 11:04:40 GMT
Go mindfulness - it's like meditation but isn't
|
|
|
Post by chickster on Jul 14, 2014 13:18:00 GMT
In my adult life I try very hard to be nice and understanding of others. Which 100% true I really do care.But I'm hit and miss. I'm volatile, frustrated easily and treat people like shit sometimes. I always feel so bad after iv done something. Or said something dismissive to someone. God this could be me. Ive just been asked to move out of an office Im subletting because I behaved badly. I had a lot of stuff nicked by a cleaner & did not react well - I didnt scream or throw things, but I was abrupt & obviously very annoyed & people just cant deal with it. The people I ware not nice to were somewhat dismissive & even a bit rude when it got pinched but thats not the point - other people dont act like this if pushed. Im not so sure its background, I think it might be the ADHD itself. I know Im a lot better on the meds but it only takes a window of a few un medicated hours plus a load of stress & Im likely to say or do something I regret. I never start it - but I certainly finish it. Not good. Maybe meditation is the/an answer?
|
|
|
Post by astraka on Jul 14, 2014 15:37:13 GMT
fjord and carly31 re walking meditation - I think I get that with Tai Chi. It's the type of kinesthetic routine which enables me to zone in at the exclusion of other things. I also get it when showering - which is when I get most of my good ideas. All I need is a waterproof dry wipe board (oxymoron alert!) to put these ideas down without forgetting them as soon as the showering process ends Yes! Showering is a great place for ideas. I reckon I could use a marker on the bathroom tiles or glass if I could find a solvent that could take it off.
|
|
|
Post by contrarymary on Jul 14, 2014 17:22:11 GMT
i have loads of insight/ideas in the shower, during meditation or yoga.
i do meditation where i'm listening to something, either to a course or to music or the sound of the sea, or indeed both. the yoga calms me down enough for meditation or the meditation calms me down enough for yoga. sometimes i'm not really calm enough for either and i simply spend that time focussing on my breathing, getting distracted, coming back to focussing on my breathing etc.
i love the "notice but don't judge" thing underlying it - it's too easy to beat ourselves up. in fact i've just spent a day and a half doing just that. goodness life is hard work sometimes.
|
|
|
Post by carly31 on Jul 15, 2014 18:29:22 GMT
Meditation is anything that brings you to the present moment- it's just finding the right thing we can hold attention to or get around to doing!! I do find it very helpful. I've always had issues with anger and if i don't express it it builds and builds. I'm always the one who speaks up in those situations where everyone else goes quiet. Maybe it is the ADHD. It's normal emotion without the self-control to prevent it coming out. It's a double edge sword. I'm actually a very kind sensitive person but these horrible emotions just burst out and I instantly regret it. hmmm well maybe trying to find better ways of expressing anger is an idea...
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 15, 2014 18:56:55 GMT
I'm always the one who speaks up in those situations where everyone else goes quiet. LOL. We should all have the t-shirts for this one I reckon
|
|
|
Post by anotherone on Jul 22, 2014 0:08:49 GMT
Damn, I think I used to be a bully My mother left us when we were very young. I was about 2 and a half and my sis about 6 months. Inattentive mother. Hyperactive father. What followed was my dad doing his best and some of his girlfriends doing an amazing job and one of them exercising her munchausens by proxy on me and my sister. Sadly, this relationship lasted near 10 years before my father finally left her. I suspect somewhere in between the beatings, being starved, being made to stay up all night and being humiliated in front of my peers in primary and secondary school, my sense of how the world works was a bit wonky! Add a liberal topping of ADHD and boom. Here I am. Anyway, bullying. I've never hit anyone because like most bullies, I was a coward I guess. My bullying was taking the piss out of someone to the point they would never speak to me again. I didnt even have to think. My mouth would open and snide, hurtful things would spray forth, all under the guise of mates larking around. Intellectual bullying. It took me a very long time to realise what I was doing. I've still no idea where it came from but even now I have to be ultra careful when having the lols with someone. I just never know when to stop. Fast forward to the current day and there is always someone who enjoys that slghtly abrasive relationship in the work place, just asking to be taken the piss out of. I can't afford to piss off too many more people tho! Anyway, I forgave my mother for excusing herself and went and met her, for the first time, when I was about 26. We aint best buds (she's a pain in the ass tbh ) but I now have a mother. I also forgave the evil step mother who made my life almost unbearable for 10 years; age 7 - 16 I think. I walked into her house one christmas (half brother) and ate some food talked some bollocks and left. I had to do this because the negativity and rage had consumed me. Holding grudges, I think, is the worst thing possible for me. Most of us in this thread could recount our tales of woe to joe public and use their horrified expressions to validate these grudges. Shrug off the burden if you can and allow yourself to fly. I'm not flying yet but I think I may be heading in the right direction for once Sorry for the essay x
|
|
|
Post by contrarymary on Jul 22, 2014 14:21:59 GMT
well said anotherone. really well said.
|
|
|
Post by carly31 on Jul 22, 2014 22:25:35 GMT
Thank you for sharing anothertone.
|
|
|
Post by carly31 on Nov 5, 2014 0:13:26 GMT
I wrote this poem recently and it made me think of this thread! It's quite long but kind of sums up a lot of things for me. I'd like to share it with you.
Miss Cairns.
There's a girl I know who I can't stand. She laughs at those less fortunate and wills others to fail. She makes me sick but strangely I'm addicted. Sometimes she turns on me! She calls me stupid and ugly. She says I won't amount to anything and that nobody really likes me. She says all my friends feel sorry for me just because I'm mental. She says she wouldn't piss on me if I was on fire. "Why would anyone like you? You fucking loser!" I tell her to fuck off but she just laughs in my face. She says I'm pathetic and deserve nothing less. But I've had enough of her and her stupid ways. She thinks she's awesome, clever and brave! She's nobody. NOBODY! I say. She used to help me out but now she just destroys me. I'm sick of her living beside me. Looking in the mirror I see her glare, She's thinking bad things but speak if she dares! I've had enough of her, I'm sick to the back teeth. Her toxic venom poisoning me, poisoning my mind, poisoning my world, Poisoning every goddamn mother fucking ounce of my soul. Get away from me you disgusting bitch. Get out of my mind. Get out of my world you're not welcome anymore. Everything you touch turns sour, Like festering milk on a hot summers day. I'm sick of you taking up my space. You're just a bully, you don't know me. You think you're me but that couldn't be further from the truth. You're made up! You're just the image other's conjured up. Get out of my mind and back where you belong, In the gutters of other people's minds is where you are from. Take it back you bastards, look at hat you've done. I was a child! I did nothing wrong. What made you think you had that right? The right to destroy and innocent child. A delicate creature with a future so bright. What chance did I have? "You're stupid, be quiet". "Shut up, you child". A child with no ego is a child who is sad. The corruption of life hits them early and hard. We're no different deep down inside. Tortured and sad. We look in the mirror pitiful and angry. "Why me?" we say "why is my life so bad?". It's time to look in the mirror and face the truth. YOU have become the very thing you detest. YOU are the bully who judges so hard. You envy success and revel in misery. The world is your mirror because you're so self-obsessed. You can't see past your fragile ego and fragmented self. You're stuck in childhood searching for answers. Stuck in a cycle of validating your delusions. "I'm disgusting, I'm vile, I have no worth". Yet, you're special, and everyone else is beneath you, aren't they?... "There's nothing good enough for me in this world, this isn't where I belong". An easier truth to conceive than face the pain of rejection, For rejection is the worst pain of them all. A child who's rejected can't ever trust. All people are bad and I'm stuck in a rut.
|
|