chappy
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Post by chappy on Sept 5, 2015 1:20:56 GMT
I was wondering if any of you have been successful in applying for PIP? I am going through the process at the moment and although I have other co-morbid conditions that contribute to my general daily difficulties, most of my problems stem from ADHD and everything that go's with that. I know PIP is dependant on how your daily life is affected by your conditions and not just solely on diagnosis's, but I am interested to know if any of you have scored enough points based on your ADHD. I applied in March and had help filling out the form from an advisor from my housing association. I included lots of evidence of my difficulties including a letters from my psychiatrist and the therapist that I was doing CBT with, also lots of medical history with original diagnosis's for ADHD, Depression, Anxiety & uncontrolled motor and verbal tic's (the swearing sort!). I also included copies of prescriptions for all the med's I take. I had my assessment in June with ATOS and got a decision at the start of July saying that I hadn't scored enough points for daily living. I got a copy of the medical report that ATOS did and there were so many things wrong or that hand on heart did not reflect my day to day life. The assessor was a bit of a snake to be honest, he was all very friendly and chatty but was very selective with what he put in his report and in some cases outright lied. The mental state examination (MSE) that he did on the sly was way off the mark and this is what was used to say that what was written in my application form was inconsistent with the MSE. I also think they used a bit of entrapment as in the decision makers report from the DWP it states that I demonstrated good budgeting skills at the assessment, when in fact I was not asked about budgeting in the assessment but I did ask reception for an expenses form to claim back my travel costs after they offered one to me. I asked for a mandatory reconsideration and wrote a long letter going through each point of the assessors report and explaining where it was wrong and backing up what I was saying with evidence from my specialists and got a letter back saying that they were not able to change the original decision. I am now in the process of tribunal as I am still unhappy with the decision. If I'm genuinely not entitled to PIP then that fair enough, but to say I'm not entitled and quoting a flawed and inaccurate medical report as the reason just don't sit well with me and I am not going to let them get away with it. I have now got a letter from my GP which I included with my tribunal application to the court that lists out each applicable descriptor from the PIP application that's in dispute and how my conditions meet the criteria. I am really hoping that they can see that I'm not just making it all up and short of taking pictures of my disorganised and messy flat, the medical aids I use to try and keep track of stuff, pictures of burned dinners I have forgotten about and red letters from bill I have forgotten to pay, I don't know what else I can do? Anyway, I was only going to write a few lines asking for any feedback from any of you that have experience with the PIP application process but it's now turned into a chunk more text than I planned! TL;DR Have any of you claimed PIP for how ADHD affects your daily life? I am trying at the moment and it's a pain in the butt Thanks
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Post by petra on Sept 5, 2015 2:03:14 GMT
I currently receive DLA and am in the process of applying for PIP - I've got the interview on Wednesday so am trying to get my head round it atm. It certainly does seem appalling how they go about it and the 'tricks' they play. I am fortunate to have a proffessional to help me who knows the game - without her I'd have no chance. I came across this website today which may be of use to you link
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Post by contrarymary on Sept 5, 2015 5:18:27 GMT
i have heard of so many people who have been through very similar process to you but have given up because asking for reconsideration or appealing was too hard- well done for persevering!!! the website i have found really helpful time and time again is www.benefitsandwork.co.uk. run by two former specialist disability benefit advisers who set up a website, forum, produce guides to each stage of the process, complile statitistics, ask FOA questions and do training for CAB, lawyers etc. they run the site as a membership organisation with an annual fee of about £15, and it's the most helpful money i spend each year. as a member you can download the guides, ask questions in the forum etc. i found it incredibly helpful; there are times when it alone has kept me sane good luck
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chappy
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Post by chappy on Sept 5, 2015 12:53:21 GMT
Thank you Petra and Contrarymary for the replies and links. I have Had a look at both of the sites you have linked and have been on them before from countless hours of google-fu when I should have been in bed or doing other stuff. I have heard good things about the benefits and work site, but a combination of being skint (due to poor budgeting!) and a bloody minded stubbornness that the truth is the truth and that should be enough, has stopped me subscribing.
It's very sad that there is a layer of dirty tricks that you have to navigate to get through a process that's meant to help people. One of the reasons that I'm following through with it is that I feel like they are calling me a liar. I told the truth throughout my application and brought lots of evidence, but they have given so much weight to the MSE that the assessor did and pretty much ignored what I have said in the form, interview or what the specialist letter say.
I can only hope that once I sit down with a judge at tribunal, they will be impartial and see that the balance of probabilities based on the evidence and my statement are stacked in my favour and what I am saying is the truth.
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Post by manson88 on Sept 5, 2015 14:19:48 GMT
I just want to share my experience with as a word of caution.
I have been through the DLA claim system twice turn down twice. Been to two tribunal's also.
My first experience of a tribunal was unacceptable the way I was treated.
My representative pulled out at at last moment. Told me to go ahead and ask for adjournment as he could not attend.
The panel had my Dr notes. Plus additional evidence. Of which they took their time reading and going over.
Anyhow so they called me in, a Dr a barrister and a lay person (think she was a social worker)
The chair person started to ask me questions about were my representative was and put me under pressure which she could see that I was having trouble containing myself. Furthermore there was two professionals sitting beside and never said anything.
They could clearly see that the chair person was causing me extreme anxiety. My fit or flight was starting to engage I was shaking in my boots. Ready to clear the place lol.
So I got it adjourned. I went of in to my car & cried. I have made a complaint about what has happened. I have tried to get a solicitor on the scene but a at a £125 per hour I can't afford.
So currently I'm harassing them each month to find out if the investigation into what happened is any further on. It's a act of discrimination of what has happened and all I'm looking for is an apology.
I feel that they are covering it up and trying to play down hoping that I will give, but it's not going to happen. Protecting the char person involved.
So this experience has put me off from another tribunal. I have had one since for DLA to which didn't win.
I don't trust the panel-chair person's I wouldn't be surprised if they were watching my name/case and had a grudge against me.
It's real soul distorying when ever you know that you have the conditions and the life that goes with them.
I hope you are aware that it's not as easy as filling in a form & sending it.
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Post by petra on Sept 5, 2015 16:13:41 GMT
I've finally bitten the bullet and paid the membership fee for benefits and work as recommended by contrarymary. It's too important a thing to mess about with hoping to find tidbits of information for free off the net. I really can't stand the whole thing - I don't like having to claim benefits. I don't like how society including members of my own family view the whole thing. I don't like the feeling that I'm effectively judged as lying about my conditions until I can prove to their satisfaction that I'm telling the truth. Plus, I'm just recovering from being unwell physically, which greatly impacts on my mental health and I need to be focusing on all this stuff like a hole in the head. I'm so tired, and it's all so overwhelming I could cry. But I can't because there isn't time and how I 'perform' in the interview on Wednesday is going to determine the quality of my life for the next period of time and whether I have to take this to tribunal - which right now is a totally overwhelming prospect. I feel like I did before my A levels exams - the realisation I should have attended a lot more classes than I did, that I shouldn't have left all the coursework till the last minute, and should have built in a plan in for revising...and basically it was all too little too late. These factors were accurately reflected in my grades. Urghh Thanks to the OP for making me think more about this as opposed to semi burying my head in the sand, to cm for the all important link, and Manson for further confirmation I need to get myself in gear. So now, I need to get off here and onto 'there'.
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Post by contrarymary on Sept 5, 2015 17:10:05 GMT
good luck petra - and PM me if i can help with anything xx
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Post by manson88 on Sept 5, 2015 18:18:56 GMT
petra I feel your pain just remember that you never suffer alone we are all in this one together. You remember the fight against the system we had to get were we are now? Well that's what we need to do is to get 'there' find the energy that got us there. Manson88 Xo
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chappy
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Post by chappy on Sept 5, 2015 19:28:19 GMT
Hi Petra,
The assessment itself is nothing to be worried about, no doubt they will be very friendly and welcoming and make you feel at ease. Just remember that they are not really being friendly and that there is a reason for everything they talk to you about even if it sounds mundane at the time. If you have any questions about my experience of the process so far, feel free to ask and I would be happy to send you a message about specific details or reply here with more general answers.
My mother also has an assessment on Tuesday but is way too ill to attend the centre, so they are coming to her for a home visit.
Hope all go's well for you and I will update this thread about an further news on my claim if anyone is interested.
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Post by blaze on Sept 5, 2015 19:39:18 GMT
Disability rights UK have a handbook-discounted for anyone on benefits- about how to fill in the forms/understand assessment question. You can also insist on an expert in your condition (or area of conditions) to assess you, and to take an advocate. The welfare rights department of local social work dept are great for how to claim benefits- but I'm still not sure if this is just a Scottish thing or not.
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Post by petra on Sept 6, 2015 3:55:09 GMT
You can also insist on an expert in your condition (or area of conditions) to assess you, This is exactly my issue - if I had an adhd / mood disorder specialist assessing me I wouldn't be stressed. I'd know they had a fundamental understanding.The chances of being assessed by someone who a) doesn't know much about adhd or b) doesn't believe it exists seem extremely high to me. And given that, it's even more a case of whether they believe you are telling the truth and / or they can make their own assumptions. I think the DLA assessments were so much fairer - everything about these PIP assessments doesn't sit right with me. The whole thing feels flawed and so obviously designed to lower costs for the government - way beyond what is genuine and necessary. I think many people will suffer because of them.
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Post by petra on Sept 6, 2015 4:03:31 GMT
I have heard good things about the benefits and work site, but a combination of being skint (due to poor budgeting!) and a bloody minded stubbornness that the truth is the truth and that should be enough, has stopped me subscribing. But that's the whole point. The truth isn't enough. I've resisted subscribing too, but I'm glad I have now (again, thanks contrarymary - I know this isn't the first time you've recommended this site..though until I saw it in this thread I'd completely forgotten!).
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chappy
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Post by chappy on Sept 11, 2015 4:04:58 GMT
I currently receive DLA and am in the process of applying for PIP - I've got the interview on Wednesday so am trying to get my head round it atm. It certainly does seem appalling how they go about it and the 'tricks' they play. I am fortunate to have a proffessional to help me who knows the game - without her I'd have no chance. I came across this website today which may be of use to you link
How did your interview go if you don't mind me asking?
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Post by petra on Sept 11, 2015 23:55:03 GMT
Hi chappy. Well, she was running behind so appt ended up being 11/2 hours late by which time my advocate had to leave. I saw a general nurse - not even a mh nurse. It lasted 2 3/4 hours and was totally exhausting. They hadn't been in touch with my psychiatrist - just had the copy of my care plan...which I sent to them as it has my diagnosis listed on it. The only other info on it is, 1) I'm to take my medication (you don't say!) and 2) if I'm struggling to contact the mental health team. (Won't go into details but they are the last people I would contact if I was struggling). So, after I calmed down, I tried to explain that for me at least, care plans mean nothing...but they have to be written and signed for each patient so the box can be ticked. I won't hear the result for 4 - 8 weeks and am poised to appeal if necessary. I've kept going over it - I think I got everything across - but it all depends on how it's written up and the person who reads/ interprets it and allocates the points at the end of the day. It's hard not to feel cynical. I've got a picture in my head of the latter person being given bonuses for every claimant they can either withdraw or reduce benefits from. I found the whole thing, the days leading up to it hugely stressful. Additionally, I've spent days and nights hyper focusing on what I can't do and how my disabilities affect me in day to day life as this is the content of interview. Not a good exercise if you have mh problems!
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Post by hermanli on Sept 12, 2015 0:17:03 GMT
Thanks for making this thread chappy. I was expecting to share some insight when I saw the title but after reading I realised you have been much further through the process than me!
I have not had my assessment yet, its in early October.
I actually became too unwell to even attempt participating in anything resembling work back in April, and started a whole bunch of things then. A massive complaints case against local NHS, a battle for external assessments (ADHD & Psych issues), then did my application for ESA (which I successfully got) followed by PIP form.
The PIP form took me a month of solid work, and thats only because I had previously done the ESA form which took much longer, and I copied/pasted parts. I am dreading my assessment greatly, I explained in detail I am not well enough to face such things. And that if I was forced to attend the assessment would have to be split into several sessions, as there is literally no hope at all of me accurately answering any question. They paid no attention of course. There are only a handful of specialist psychiatrists in the country who have the skills to assess my complex combination of neurodevelopmental & psych disorders. Whomever their "medical professional" is, I have a feeling they will not be any more qualified than a GP.
Could you tell me what kind of professional your original assessor was? and their level of knowledge/experience.
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Post by hermanli on Sept 12, 2015 0:26:53 GMT
I looked it up:
We are keen to attract qualified Nurses, Occupational Therapists, Physiotherapists and Paramedics to become part of an empathetic, caring team that will be focused on the PIP's claimant's journey, ensuring we offer a personal yet objective assessment. Hold a current and valid NMC / HCPC / GMC registration Package:
Salary - £32,000
Looks like I was right, I looked at several sources for these jobs all around the country. They are all the same. I am shocked to see not only a lack of consultant level professionals, but not even doctors. They are just nurses, physio's, occupational therapists & paramedics etc!
I am kind of gobsmacked, how are any of these people supposed to do a psychiatric assessment when even a normal consultant level psychiatrist usually stumbles when someone has ADHD, Autism and such?
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chappy
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Post by chappy on Sept 12, 2015 17:51:09 GMT
Could you tell me what kind of professional your original assessor was? and their level of knowledge/experience. My consultant told me he was a paramedic. When I asked what his experience of mental health was he just replied that he deals with all health problems both mental and physical. He was quite knowledgeable about the medications that I was taking but I was very aware of him trying to put words in my mouth. Like he would say "ah what about shopping? you pop round the local shop do you, would you say that's about 5 mins walk?" Also when he was asking about any hobbies, you know that he is not really interested it's just a loaded question to facilitate a Mental State Examination (MSE). The MSE is the thing that they are using to say that I am doing ok basically and that my form and evidence is inconsistent with the MSE. When I read the report the thing that shocked and made me angry the most was haw far off the mark the MSE was. Also that it was done on the sly without him saying anything, it's all done through informal observations. Anyway, I got a confirmation letter today from the courts and tribunal services saying that they have my appeal and they have sent a copy to the DWP for a written response. Lets see how that go's. Also good luck Petra, I hope it all turns out ok for you
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Post by petra on Sept 13, 2015 7:19:40 GMT
The big flaw with the MSE is these assessments cause adrenalin/ stimulation for adhd'ers - I fear I appeared extremely on the ball at mine! Was half dead and exhausted for the rest of the day, but she didn't see that bit. That's the nature of the adhd aspect.
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Post by manson88 on Sept 13, 2015 14:54:42 GMT
RANT ALTERT!! My experience of a DLA tribunal. (no offence to anyone here) Why is though a system to help us being applying for benefits/getting a diagnosis getting the right support causes us so much stress??? You go to your appointment which your fairly stressed about. To be judged by someone who has been successful in life. With letters after their name and their 5 series BMW parked up outside. You get looked down at as if you are below them.. As your life wasn't had enough just to exist. But the feeling of being judgment is difficult. I didn't choose to be the person I am. I don't want to be here either. So why make me feel so uncomfortable. The panel of experts at a DLA tribunal are a doctor, a barrister and a disability lay person. Just for them to decide whether you meet the criteria. It's tuff... This is the bit I find the hardest! I'm no different than anyone else on here I need support, each day is different yes but I still need it. It's really frustrating system, when there's people telling us you have a disability you need support! Apply for the benefits. The reality is that you're not going to get on less they see you on your hands and knees which is unfair. Then you have the politicians saying if people don't apply for the benefits they are going stop setting the money aside for them. Then we network and here of are peers & their experiences of this system that causes us so much stress and we put off trying. The truth is this, the rich get richer and poor they stay the same! I can see how social deprivation happens. We are social excluded because we don't get what it takes to live a full live. Are life is restricted by are disabilities. Try looking for a job without qualifications. It's not gonna happen. Then people say go and get some we trapped by are own anxieties. Financially and academically... We are shunned to one side. Cause at school we didn't have what it took to achieve the success of are peers. I myself was left at the back of the class with a box of motors while the teacher took the rest of the class for English lesson. Cause of my dyslexia. Teacher just didn't have time for me. Are children suffer as well, even though they don't have a disability! Why cause it's social exclusion. Cause we dnt have the money to send our kids to the trips with the school or after school activities. Its fact that children that come from a poorer social economic back round don't do as well! Rant over manson88 The big flaw with the MSE is these assessments cause adrenalin/ stimulation for adhd'ers - I fear I appeared extremely on the ball at mine! Was half dead and exhausted for the rest of the day, but she didn't see that bit. That's the nature of the adhd aspect.
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chappy
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Post by chappy on Sept 13, 2015 19:33:50 GMT
The big flaw with the MSE is these assessments cause adrenalin/ stimulation for adhd'ers - I fear I appeared extremely on the ball at mine! Was half dead and exhausted for the rest of the day, but she didn't see that bit. That's the nature of the adhd aspect. Yeah that was the first thing on the MSE, "Did not look tired" when in fact I had about 2 hours sleep the night before because I was so worried/excited about getting the assessment out of the way. Another one was "did not appear restless and showed good concentration", if only that were the case, I am like a duck gliding along in the pond looking cool and calm, where below the surface I'm franticly paddling just to keep my head above water.... ATossers...
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Post by petra on Sept 13, 2015 22:33:58 GMT
manson88 - all what you've just said here is incredibly well communicated. I don't suffer with dyslexia, but apart from that all what you said is exactly how I feel. I can't imagine how damaging to your childhood, life and self esteem dyslexia must be...and yet you are clearly very bright...which probably makes it feel worse and more frustrating. Another layer to be suffocated under.. Us lot seriously need to stick together!
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Post by manson88 on Sept 13, 2015 23:05:53 GMT
Thank you petra, That rant is something that has been working on me for a long while! That to be honest is how I see the world. I have no time for professionals. But anyway we all can't be David Beckham and play premier league football. Some of us just have to stay in division 3...sad story is there is no way of getting out of it. The best thing that ever I got in my hand was my mobile phone. Cause I'm liberated, set free nearly from my dyslexic traits. But it's 2hrs typing then my anxiety would get in the way then delete half of it and start all over again. Or I'd loose my train of thought and get frustrated and have to set it down and come back to it. Hence,dyslexia, Add, anxiety disorders. If I where to write by hand I'd been even longer no one would be able to read it though. Manson88
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Post by hermanli on Sept 14, 2015 0:55:01 GMT
Us lot seriously need to stick together! Does anyone want to start this out with advocating for each other? I have my assessment too and I massively need support, someone to talk for me. Ive asked my sister, but after an entire lifetime of being secretive about how severe my problems are, and because of the very personal nature of psych problems. Just explaining things to my sister is going to be completely humiliating. I would be very willing to advocate for others, just no good at doing so for myself. Located in the Midlands (not saying exactly where in case "they" are spying!)
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Post by blaze on Sept 16, 2015 6:32:03 GMT
RANT ALTERT!! My experience of a DLA tribunal. (no offence to anyone here) Why is though a system to help us being applying for benefits/getting a diagnosis getting the right support causes us so much stress??? [@br]You go to your appointment which your fairly stressed about. To be judged by someone who has been successful in life. With letters after their name and their 5 series BMW parked up outside. You get looked down at as if you are below them.. As your life wasn't had enough just to exist. But the feeling of being judgment is difficult. I didn't choose to be the person I am. I don't want to be here either. So why make me feel so uncomfortable. The panel of experts at a DLA tribunal are a doctor, a barrister and a disability lay person. Just for them to decide whether you meet the criteria. It's tuff... This is the bit I find the hardest! I'm no different than anyone else on here I need support, each day is different yes but I still need it. It's really frustrating system, when there's people telling us you have a disability you need support! Apply for the benefits. The reality is that you're not going to get on less they see you on your hands and knees which is unfair. Then you have the politicians saying if people don't apply for the benefits they are going stop setting the money aside for them. Then we network and here of are peers & their experiences of this system that causes us so much stress and we put off trying. The truth is this, the rich get richer and poor they stay the same! I can see how social deprivation happens. We are social excluded because we don't get what it takes to live a full live. Are life is restricted by are disabilities. Try looking for a job without qualifications. It's not gonna happen. Then people say go and get some we trapped by are own anxieties. Financially and academically... We are shunned to one side. Cause at school we didn't have what it took to achieve the success of are peers. I myself was left at the back of the class with a box of motors while the teacher took the rest of the class for English lesson. Cause of my dyslexia. Teacher just didn't have time for me. Are children suffer as well, even though they don't have a disability! Why cause it's social exclusion. Cause we dnt have the money to send our kids to the trips with the school or after school activities. Its fact that children that come from a poorer social economic back round don't do as well! Rant over manson88 [quote author=" petra" Isnt the problem that the assesors dont have letters after their nanes? Oratleast not enough. And the wages posted above would not cover the cost of a decent bmw, not once morgage and childcare is paid for- which is the reality for the average person. There are many of us adhers who have qualifications also, just perhaps 'under' achieved fkr what our iqs would suggest or its cost us more in time, energy, money and effort than a non disabled person. timestamp="1442128780" source="/post/92512/thread"]The big flaw with the MSE is these assessments cause adrenalin/ stimulation for adhd'ers - I fear I appeared extremely on the ball at mine! Was half dead and exhausted for the rest of the day, but she didn't see that bit. That's the nature of the adhd aspect. [/quote]
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Post by hermanli on Oct 20, 2015 11:58:59 GMT
Reporting back.
Have PIP living & mobility awarded.
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Post by vagueandrandom on Oct 21, 2015 0:12:55 GMT
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Post by petra on Oct 21, 2015 1:14:19 GMT
Reporting back. Have PIP living & mobility awarded. Excellent news. And me!
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Post by hermanli on Oct 21, 2015 1:15:54 GMT
wonderful x
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nikdh1987
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Post by nikdh1987 on Oct 21, 2015 6:02:18 GMT
Is there any way of getting the form for this? I was sure at one point you could?
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Post by contrarymary on Oct 21, 2015 8:50:51 GMT
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